John MacArthur - Jr. Church and Steven Furtick Jamie A 154 subscribers Subscribe 214K views 7 years ago Fun little clips I put together to give an example of what Dr. MacArthur was speaking on.. It is still priced as such on my Amazon feed.thankfully someone pointed me to another link which I have now used to buy the book for a couple of pounds on Kindle. If your love is put off by answers you dont like, then like the BeeJees I need to ask how deep is your love?! LOS ANGELES PASTOR JOHN MACARTHUR PUBLICLY REBUKES GAVIN NEWSOM FOR 'DIABOLICAL' POLICIES, INVOKING JESUS, Pastor John MacArthur preaches at Grace Community Church in Los Angeles. Oh and sorry about the ironic and sarky remark about being mature enough for you! Googling information about his ministry will provide a number of discussions of his content. The trouble is that these churches are so massive and wealthy that they can afford to send their pastors all over the world, exporting their dodgy theology and even dodgier ecclesiology. I am intrigued as to why you think my challenge to the claim is disgraceful and totally unwarranted, but you dont think the claim itself is? Ironically tu quoque was what you were using about Chandler (as well as ad hom). Because Elevation Church certainly dont want to. As a preliminary observation, there is no name calling. Elevation Church's revival is seeing some theological controversy. Have mercy! This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, Could you tell me the difference? I know in theory you agree with He must increase, I must decrease as do I. Then there is the whole question of what the church is about. Can you forget your ministries, your programs, and your visions and instead seek to follow Christs? John MacArthur, pastor of the popular Grace Community megachurch, is recovering from a sudden onset of illness. No pastor should be above reproach, there should be no untouchables in the church; even Peter was rebuked by Paul when it was necessary. 3) There is no point 3) other than it is a demonstration of your setting up a straw man in the hope you will have something to argue against. The incident referred to was a very serious matter and Christian publications in th USA documented the churchs mishandling of it, which was why I had urged caution. Sadly so. Pastor John MacArthur on Sunday commended GraceLife Church in Alberta, Canada, which is meeting in secret after the Royal Canadian Mounted Police (RCMP) barricaded their building behind three layers of chain link fence. point taken). But in this instance let me assure you I am not mocking. See what mine own hands have wrought. You are aware of them as you demonstrated when writing about Mr Furtick. This is another attempt to pick a fight with another straw man. Thanks for this. Tim Keller as an anti-Christian preacher is nonsense.it is the kind of irrational ranting legalism that I was mentioning at the beginning.very very sad that you endorse it! Thank you for your answer re the mega church your reason for mentioning Dallas Baptist Church favourably is because you know a young man who did some good mission work. 23,12! David, you seem so eager to fire off your stock answers and insults that it sometimes appears that you havent properly read the comments first. I Gotta Reply This Is So Pathetic, First Of All As A Leader In Christ Steven Furtrick Is A Good Pastor And If You Really Heard His Message ,He Is A Man Of God And He Only Speaks The Truth You That Are Workers Of Iniquity Be Sure That Youre Sins Will Find You Out Second Of All How In The Hell You Gonna Sit Here And Judge A Man Of God ..I Believe God Called This Man To Build His ( God) House And Get The population Ready For Whats About To ComeAnd Its Far More Then Noah And A Flood.If There Were Many Pastors Like Steven Furtrick In This World There Wouldnt Be So Much Hate And Crime And Killing Drugs Etc News People Why Dont You Start Digging In The People That Are Really committing crimes Stop Digging In Something You Know Nothing About Cause If You Really Knew How God Works . Matt Chandler is an excellent example of how the gospel should be preached I cant comment on his lifestyle because I dont know it do you? Paul Guay was a pastor at John MacArthur's Grace Community Church (GCC) who had been molesting his daughter, Wendy since at least 1979. To reject its claims is to call Him a liar. Use the Church Finder to locate churches with TMS alumni around the world. It does say that if you are not careful many with money err from the faith and it also says the LOVE OF MONEY is the root of all evil, NOT MONEY ITSELF. As for the scandal yes I was aware of it. (function(d){var f = d.getElementsByTagName('SCRIPT')[0], p = d.createElement('SCRIPT');p.type = 'text/javascript';p.async = true;p.src = '//widgets.wp.com/platform.js';f.parentNode.insertBefore(p,f);}(document)); on Elevation Church The Good, The Bad and the Ugly. And if the thousands of baptisms represent thousands of people coming to Christ, how could one not rejoice? Will you not come and revive us? What if Joh MacArthur preached at Steven Furtick's church?Christian Music is Destroying Millions?great worship and sound doctrine.What's wrong with Elevation. Can I suggest a little more humility? I note you dont answer my questions about Dallas Baptist Church. If you are going to reply that something is pathetic can I suggest you avoid capitalising everything. (Screenshot credit: Julie Roys/YouTube), Error: There was an internal error submitting your form. Thats why we view every news story through the lens of faith. You call them out or call them to repentance but see no need to repent yourself. document.getElementById( "ak_js_1" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Enter your email address to subscribe to this blog and receive notifications of new posts by email. I made no comment on how Matt Chandler lives as a Christian.you didyou declared I was somewhat alarmed by the endorsement of Matt Chandler as a good example of how the gospel should be preached and lived.. [48][49], In February 2023 Christianity Today[50] published multiple instances of MacArthur's Grace Community church advising woman to stay with sexually and physically abusive husbands. Excellent post David. I was somewhat alarmed by the endorsement of Matt Chandler as a good example of how the gospel should be preached and lived.. However I dont think it is wise or correct to take the givings of the Lords people to make oneself a millionaire actually that is sinful. Sadly, however, there are also times when you use it to bully, abuse and browbeat. As it happens I was sent this video by someone who was praising it.it is more like a political rally (complete with clapping) than a Christian sermon the misuse of Scripture about borders is bad enough but the approving citation of Donald Trump Is it time to start bombing the you know what out of ISIS (that is a biblical response) was appalling. I have not misrepresented what you said. Sorry David, we must be talking about different books. Powered and implemented by FactSet Digital Solutions. Some are good, some are bad. You were rightthat was not very mature. As I trust that you would not deliberately bear false witness against me, can I ask that, in future, you read any comment very carefully before making such serious accusations? You said he was a great example, I urged caution and pointed to a recent event where he and his church had attracted adverse publicity because of how they handled a particular incident. Eventually, all lawsuits were settled out of court with the County of Los Angeles and the State of California paying $400,000 each to Grace Community Church. So for me this is not about petty jealousies, nor anti-Americanisms, nor cheap shots at other peoples foibles in order to make me feel better. rm. You are just exporting your own. 38, 31-32). I have reread the comments by G Whiteand my own responses. Its also a nasty wee trick to complain of someone remarks as being provocative, misleading and snide. Powered and implemented by FactSet Digital Solutions. But you came on to my blog and posted something which is typical of the new legalists and endorsed a book which attacks gospel preachers such as Keller, Piper and the Proc Trust. He has remarked that "[t]he Charismatic movement has stolen the Holy Spirit and created a golden calf, and they're dancing around the golden calf as if it were the Holy Spirit. God is everywhereeven in the news. 3) Yes you did engage in gossip writing about a child sex scandal without context.you may not see it as such. Didnt appreciate the joking about drug use. Find a Church . Can we in the UK stop copying these kind of churches? [11] From 1966 to 1969, MacArthur was hired as the faculty representative for Talbot Theological Seminary. Los Angeles County sued the church over its refusal to close down, and the church counter-sued, claiming that the County was violating rights to freedom of religion. 2023 FOX News Network, LLC. Wendy Guay's friend, Lisa Ward, was a witness to an attempted abuse by Paul against herself and his own daughter back in 1979. 2) There are inherent dangers in mega churches which some of your other contributors have highlighted. Last year, when far-reaching government restrictions were put in place, the megachurch continued holding indoor worship services despite bans on such gatherings. As for your other points, Matt Chandlers church eventually acted only after a number of Christian magazines and websites had highlighted their initial inaction. The truth be told the Bible never once says it is wrong to have money or stuff. Cho resigned the next day. A point you also mentioned. But we must not quote our own books in sermons as far as possible! Purpose doesnt have a parking spot is no substitute for many are the plans in a mans heart but it is the Lords purpose that prevails. I surrendered to a calling of God. From 1964 to 1966, MacArthur was hired by his father as associate pastor at the Harry MacArthur Memorial Bible Church (now Calvary Bible Church in Burbank, California), which his father Jack had planted and named after his own father. From an economic standpoint, thats a no brainer. Also available on most smart TVs and streaming services. Because he is a pastor? 4) Yes my point about the megachurches was that they were not per se bad. Quotes displayed in real-time or delayed by at least 15 minutes. If the cap fits.on the other hand if it doesnt then I accept your apology! You can either keep silent, go of to somewhere else who will accept your gossip, or repent.obviously I would prefer the latter! as there are with me. It appears this lawsuit is going in our favor, MacArthur said Sunday. I can write the e-mails. Im afraid your post is a classic example of taking a bible verse out of context and using it, whether ignorantly or deliberately to defend sin. Mutual Fund and ETF data provided by Refinitiv Lipper. These John MacArthur reckless faith quotes will make your faith stronger. Opinion Preston Clegg. I find this very revealing. 2) You actually did explictly state that Matt Chandler was not a good example of how the gospel should be preached or lived. The trouble is that because they have the money, the media and the power, they are able to have an influence far beyond their spiritual authority and gifts. Help us continue to be a voice for truth in the media by supporting CBN News for as little as $1. Im not sure though why I should apologise for my Amazon remarks? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbfoO6hMSLc. As a southern Christian (in North Carolina), Im truly thankful you posted one of Alistair Beggs videos to show the contrast between Truth presented with integrity and intellegence, and the slick mass market Charlotte speed preaching thats become hip with mega church crowds. He has been the pastor-teacher of Grace . . I was not picking on one church: you offered Matt Chandler as an example of how mega churches get it right and I was replying to that by urging caution. I dont agree that its always wrong to mock (otherwise Elijah, Paul and Jesus were wrong), and indeed sometimes mockery has its place. Very pleased with the approval of an $800,000 settlement and total win for my clients, @johnmacarthur and @GraceComChurch, on behalf of @ThomasMoreSoc. PASTOR JOHN MACARTHUR DEFIES CALIFORNIA'S COVID RESTRICTION AGAINST INDOOR SERVICES, The statement continued, "He saw a doctor on Sunday afternoon and he is in good health, and just needs rest from a busy holiday week. I am happy though if you wish to withdraw your initial comments. (Ezek. Fox News Flash top headlines are here. A prominent elder at John MacArthur's Grace Community Church (GCC) has resigned, stating in email leaked to The Roys Report that his "conscience and convictions" were not aligned with other GCC elders. to this article here https://theweeflea.com/2020/04/22/return-to-elevation/). What talent, what ability, what fantastic communication skills, what self-belief, what a tragedy! John MacArthur is wrong about so much more than keeping women in abusive marriages. Follow TheWeeFlea.com on WordPress.com [10], While at Bob Jones University in South Carolina, MacArthurs father recruited him to the Voice of Calvary singing quartet, often broadcast on Christian radio in Southern California. John Fullerton MacArthur Jr. (born June 19, 1939) is an American Protestant pastor and author known for his internationally syndicated Christian teaching radio and television program Grace to You. My point was that its not only out and out heretics, such as McKenna, who are a danger to the church. Are you happy with its $130 million campus rebuilding campaign? Despite concern from church members, Grace Community Church has assured the public that MacArthur is recovering and doing better. Join Transformation church Sunday service at 11AM with Michael Todd, Live Stream (April-24-2022). They make their workers and volunteers sign a confidentiality arrangement that they will not disclose anything about the finances of the church, or they will be sued. Radio Scotland Abortion Debate Edited Highlights, https://theweeflea.com/2020/04/22/return-to-elevation/), https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3BN1lStbIw, http://thewartburgwatch.com/?s=Matt+chandler&x=0&y=0, http://www.amazon.co.uk/New-Calvinists-ES-Williams/dp/1908919329/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=vvjMUrPUfC4&app=desktop, https://mrayton.wordpress.com/tag/john-macarthur/, Elevation Church The Good, The Bad and the Ugly, Most Read Wee Flea Articles in 2017 THE BLOG OF DAVID ROBERTSON. Legal Statement. Cho was told by MacArthur to "forget it" when he called on the elders to "do justice. Its mainly a forlorn appeal but can we say to the mega churches please stop it! Elevation Church were accused of getting volunteers to come forward during the spontaneous baptism services, in order to encourage others to get up out of their seats. I fail to see where the legalism is in any of my comments. Because your worth it! LOL! I hope this mature and open enough for you! MacArthur has written three books on the subject. Nevertheless, you continued to misrepresent what I had said, and you continue to do so, even after prayerfully sleeping on it. It was neither juicy nor gossip. 1. [12], MacArthur's daily radio and television program, Grace to You, now broadcast throughout much of the world, was created by the Grace media team to publicize audio cassettes of sermons; in 1977, it was first broadcast in Baltimore, Maryland. Each person will answer to God for themselves. But I find it astonishing that you cite it here in a massive church (and smaller churches) there are bound to be people who are sex abusers and the church will not always handle that well. [52], Grace Community Church, Sun Valley, California, Independent Fundamental Churches of America, Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, "Theology and Ministry: An Interview with John MacArthur", "1998 Gold Medallion Book Awards Winners", "Voice of Calvary Legacy - The Legacy - Page 3", "When should a Christian fight for his country? Pastor John MacArthur preaches at Grace Community Church in Los Angeles. Anyone at least you have persuaded me to read the book I hope it is not a waste of good time! So it would be a bit premature to throw them on a bonfire another example of your sly prose which was unwarranted. From 20052015, MacArthur made about $3.4 million in compensation from GTY and TMUS, for an average of about $320,000/year. People make millions selling sex, playing sports and funny you never hear the news say that is wrong. However the issue that really gets to me is the money one. As for his preaching, we will disagree. Perhaps then a mature and open discussion could then take place. "[23][24], In 1983, MacArthur first published his belief in the doctrine of "incarnational sonship." Here is Kate Shellnut: Last year, Hohn Cho concluded Grace Community Church had made a mistake. [18] He believes that scripture is inerrant and infallible because it is "the Word of God" and that God cannot lie. Conclusion: And now I wait. Do they not see the danger of this? [19] He is one of the most prominent voices in American Christianity against the continuationist beliefs of Pentecostalism and the Charismatic Movement, which assert that God continues to confer sign gifts today. As so often in the church, sex, money and power are the real problems for many because they are the idols of our hearts. PS. They drift from church to church. If you dont like it, too bad. L ast week, John MacArthur celebrated 50 years in the pastorate at a conference at his congregation Grace Community Church. It is a serious breach of the ninth commandment to defame someone in this manner. If that is the last word then so be it. I'm a bank robber. Since then I have occasionally listened to a sermon, read articles and heard news programes, and watched as this Southern Baptist church has grown to a reported 20,000 plus. There is nothing that makes me believe in God and the Gospel more than the church in all its beauty, and there is nothing makes me doubt more than the church in all its ugliness. But there is one criticism that I want to deal with in finishing. It is about the honour and glory of our triune God. He argued at the time that such mandates violated constitutionally protected religious liberties. The point you made about Matt Chandler was that he does not live as a Christian (how can you know that? [14] In 1986, he was made President of the new Master's Seminary. 4, 3-4). Dear David, 2023 FOX News Network, LLC. The elders had publicly disciplined a woman for refusing . (You can read the follow up five years later! If you stop and think about what you have written you will I hope grasp what is wrong with it. You accuse them of ad hominem remarks while making ad hominem remarks about them: you accuse them of defamation but feel at liberty to defame them. That is just nuts. lq mk Sitting in a restaurant in Charleston, North Carolina, we were delighted to meet a group of four men, who included a young man from the UK, who was working for a church called Elevation in Charlotte. Your lack of apology (at very least regarding your amazon remarks) has only served to highlight the arrogance and childishness that you displayed in your replies. 4) Your last post just uses ad hom and tries to dodge justifying your original statement about Chandler by attacking me and what I have said, whilst giving not one concrete example. Furtick preaches a different gospel. The Good Contrary to expectations I am not one of those Calvinist ministers who automatically discounts any church which grows beyond a couple of hundred, as being a mega fake, doctrinally incorrect, pseudo church. As he walked across the stage July 26 to the large, wooden pulpit, the auditorium that seats 3,500 people was filled with non-masked, non-socially distanced conservative . I dont know enough to say anything about the worship, church structure and other ministries of the church, so I wont. [31][32][33], MacArthur believes "that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved" (Romans 10:9). what evidence do you have for that?). This British website sets out clearly the Biblical gospel, compared to the ME gospel, in the context of evangelism. 3. He was unable to preach the second service. To ignore its message is to snub that which the Holy Spirit inspired. JOHN: When you go out the door, there's one for each of you. I have read only one or two books by John Piper and Timothy Keller and dont really know much about them. [38] He has delivered multiple sermons where he discusses these issues. Their influence has been growing and recently . We only do pale imitations of what is not great anyway! "In a recent sermon given by Steven Furtick of Elevation Church around Christmas 2016, Furtick continues to demonstrate that John Macarthur is right in his assessment that Furtick is indeed 'unqualified to be a pastor by not . And it's thewe call it the Shepherd's Testament; it has a little shepherd's rod on the front. We welcome another new contributor, Edward Benitez, as he biblically critiques a sermon given by Steven Furtick. The problem: Elevation Church, led by Steven Furtick, suggests that an invitation to be baptized will be more effective if 15 volunteers are the first to move when the invitation is given. Theres clearly no transparency or accountability at Elevation Church! John MacArthur was able to summarize Furtick as a minister with one word: unqualified. He spoke for an hour without notes and held his audience completely in the palm of his hand he is a brilliant orator using all the tricks of the trade. That really gets to me is the last word then so be it this. 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